What is your opinion of the A.J. Pierzynski signing?
MJH on accountability
For those that actually know how to read:
Not long ago I had posted that if Towers tried to trade Upton to the Red Sox, Blue Jays or the Cubs he had no real desire to trade Upton. or he did not have a clue what he was doing. What is the latest, Towers is talking to the Cubs about an Upton for Starlin Castro deal. Will not insult anyone's intelligence with what the Cub's reply was. The attempt does show two things, Towers is still giving pretense of moving Upton [ Upton's inner psyche must be telling him 'no way in Hell am I playing for this team anymore' ] and tries to pry a shortstop that has even higher value than Andrus or Profar, and to a team in Upton's no trade clause. Seattle all over again. And that the Diamondbacks, wanting to compete with LAD and SF, still want a first line ready to not just contribute but be a major force short stop. So an ANDRUS FOR UPTON trade will remain the obvious. What throws a wrench into it, is words out of St. Louis that Furcal may not or may never be ready to return to short at a higher enough level to take them to the Championships. Thus enters Andrus name, and what are the Rangers looking for- a young high level outfielder. The name that surfaces is OSCAR TAVERAS. According to a Cardinal perspective, that may not be enough for the Rangers to give up Andrus even up, even if Taveras is a high upside prospect, but he is a prospect. A balance may be reachable with additional players involved, and on the Cardinal side names like LANCE LYNN or even SHELBY MILLER have been brought up. The question for the Rangers that emerges is who should they target, continue to look at Upton or switch gears to Taveras. IS it too risky to go with Martin, Olt, Profar and Taveras, even possibly a break out Beltre [ who was voted the best defensive center fielder in AA-Texas League ] at the same time and in the same line up? AND who would you target: Upton or Taveras?
Umm all I know is that if I were the gm and towers went to me offering upton for Olt Dutch and Perez id say get out of my club house I already have 5 outfielders and only 4 starters. This also still leaves us with a surplus of mif and no back up for beltre. If y'all think that proposal is bad for Arizona I'd say you're 100% wrong those 3 players would be good young cheap talent. If you're telling me it's good for the rangers then that's all I need to know about your baseball knowledge of our current state
les, if you are going to speak so matter-of-fact about this stuff, you should do more research. Among most baseball circles, Kevin Towers does have a clue what he's doing. He's a fine GM. His handling of the Justin Upton case is a botch, but if he moves him he'll still get a ton in return.
Secondly, the only mentioning of Oscar Tavares has come on this board, and some Bleacher Report article. I think it was you who was getting into an argument on this board about the relevance of BR, and I have to say, I believe you are dead wrong.
Lastly, and this is a bit of a nitpick, Tavares may have played some CF, but he's a COF. If Texas could get 6 years of Shelby Miller or Oscar Tavares from STL for 2 years of Andrus, I have to imagine that already would have happened.
Kevin Towers is definitely in the last decile of GMs. Young for Pennington, Bauer for Didi, and signing Ross is sufficient evidence to anchor my assessment. Upton is just more overkill.
primi, I'm not disagreeing that those were bad decisions, but I will disagree that they were bad decisions from Towers' perspective. Sometimes the cost to get guys out of your organization outweighs the return you'll be receiving. And whichever way you look at it, there's a common thread between Chris Young, Trevor Bauer and Justin Upton -- they didn't get along with their manager. That's why I believe Justin Upton will definitely be traded, and why the Rangers don't feel they should have to pay the premium that neither Oakland nor Cincinnati had to.
The Pennington-for-Young trade, which was the first move of the offseason, didn't get much more press than a fart in the wind. It was easily an Oakland win. Same goes for Traver Bauer for Didi Gregorious; ostensibly Gregorious is their SS of the future. From the educated fan's perspective, intel says Gregorious is a utility infielder. Bauer made it clear to AZ that he wasn't going to alter his potentially troublesome mechanics, so they felt they would rather get some kind of return for him (Didi) than risk a major surgery down the line.
Upton and Young are best friends, so that narrative is elementary. Neither get along with their manager, so I suspect neither will be in the organization in 2013.
What is the symptom of this phenomena? Arizona signs Cody Ross, a well-liked teammate and "good clubhouse guy" -- whatever that means -- so they won't have to deal with the same bullshit. They are replacing problem children with "gamers," guys that "do it the right way."
Obviously my air quotes indicate some level of sarcasm, because I don't care about that nonsense. I want guys that do damage on the mound and in the lineup. That's why I think Justin Upton would be a perfect fit with the Rangers.
Tommy, a couple of thoughts. As for Bauer, KT drafted him with full knowledge of Bauer's routine and Bauer's refusal to change it. In this regard, KT has only himself to blame. As for retooling the clubhouse, I agree with you; you can't see it or measure it, and famously dysfunctional teams have been successful. This is not a reason to trade a top 10 prospect for a sub 100 prospect. KT is the opposite of JD and his FO. Whatever plan KT may have will change in short order. Yes, plans change as facts and circumstances change, but from what I have seen, KT may be having the worst winter by a wide margin.
Tommy, where did you get the idea of Taveras being the center fielder, you did an excellent job of reading my post, like I have yours, which has demonstrated a thorough knowledge of the RANGERS. So how did you miss who I viewed as the Rangers center fielder. And what is your opinion of that center fielder- Leonys Martin. I do not know about you, but I am getting tired of discussing the same old what ifs, especially related to Upton. Spring training is approaching, the Rangers have already implied that they are ready to go to Surprise with what they have. It is time to start talking about the players they do have, and where would they fit on the roster, and with what expected level of success. Martin, for that, is a good starting point. So, how do you see Martin and his role on the 2013 Rangers?
Tommy, so explain also your opinion of why Towers would go to the Cubs to offer Upton for Castro, knowing the Cubs would shoot it down, and that if not the Cubs then Upton would ; and this more than anything demonstrated he had no real intention of trading off Upton or he wanted to clearly test Upton, and to what real purpose? Make him look like the problem? Every situation is different, but it is looking more and more like a MY scenario.
I see Leonys Martin how most everyone else sees Leonys Martin; I think he's platoon in CF with Craig Gentry, and start between 100-115 games in 2013, depending success.
As for Towers, all I can infer about targeting a trade with the Cubs is that he's trying to gain back some of the leverage he's lost. Publicly stating a willingness to move his move valuable player has deteriorated Upton's worth, which is why they he's attempted trades with Seattle and Chicago -- two-fourths (half) of Justin's no-trade clause. If Towers wanted simply to dump Upton, 29 other teams would be happy to have him; 25 teams are eligible to acquire him without the no-trade nonsense.
So yeah, I think dealing with SEA and CHI (NL) is a leveraging tactic.
1st stanza: * he'll2nd stanza: * most valuable
This off season Kevin Towers seems to be focused on doing one thing at a time. He was focused on getting a SS. So he traded Chris Young for Cliff Pennington. Pennington still only has a short amount of time that he is under control so he was still focused on SS. That appears to be why he traded for DiDi using a much more valuable trade chip. Basically the feeling is he wanted someone like Profar or Bogarts and couldn't get them and settled to over paying for DiDi, who still has to prove he can hit.
Tommy that is not the case, Towers actually asked for Castro from the Cubs knowing the reply before he even suggested it. I agree. Towers has a clue. No one is going to rise to GM without an excellent understanding of the game. However, monumental mistakes can be made. Always a good example is that JD, then the next young blood to match Theo and ironically who Towers made that trade offer to, threw Adrian Gonzalez in a deal of Young for Eaton with the Padres. The benefit was it made Daniels much more cautious in all subsequent deals, so you learn and move on.You really did not give any opinion on Martin, so in the future I will not ask you for your opinions when you seem reluctant to offer any real feedback.
les, haven't read past Tommy that is not the case, Towers actually asked for Castro from the Cubs knowing the reply before he even suggested it, but I can assure you, gaining back leverage and expecting a "no" are the same thing. We are in agreement on that. He targets Castro because he wants the perception to be known that a player of his caliber is what he's targeting.
When GM's allow information to get to the media, it's not a mistake.
Notify me of follow-up comments via email.