Good, I had suggested in the past a Cruz trade to the Mets, that was a tad unusual may not even fly with Selig, and that Cruz for Johan Santana. Where it might not, though there is precedent, is the amount of money involves, Essentially, the Mets would pay the equivalent of Santana's salary and buy-out of 2014 [ unless he suddenly finds a Fountain of Youth, becomes the ACE the Rangers have longed for, and thus the Rangers would want to pick up his 2014 option= then the Mets get the buyout of $5+m back] ; and the Rangers pay the equivalent of Cruz's 2013 $10.5 m All predicated on a Cruz replacement deal.

I apologize also. I know I offer little to this site. And I promise to offer even less in the future.

The point of the Bleacher Report, regardless of opinions on the Post itself, is being missed. Some writer, not pro-Ranger like EVERYONE of us on the forum, is saying that a Ranger pitcher is a team's ACE over one pitcher who won 16 games and had 221 Ks in a season [ and who was the last Ranger to go over 200?] and described his own season as 'so so' and another who won 18 games with a 3.29 era, demonstrates the depth of the Rangers top 3. But above that, it also demonstrates the value that other locations perceive Holland. The whole point was to bring forth the value Holland is perceived by some others that are not associated with the Rangers. To me this is a clearer picture of Holland's value outside of Texas then any of us who are so pro-Rangers. It only enhances his perceived value and how it could relate to an Upton deal.

Les:
I understand and agree with you 100%. But you must understand there is a heirarchy-a pecking order of sorts on here. And until you are in that heirarchy what you say on here has no relevance to them. I find very little useful info on here. Newberg and LoneStarBall are good and don't belittle you. Good Luck

Les

Didn't CJ have 200+ K's in 2011?

@ not that Eric

Then please feel free to show yourself the exit and never return. If you don't like it here its pretty simple. Show yourself out. You contribute the least of anyone here as you're obviously a troll. So don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

@txball. I am not in favor of Lohse, whether Holland is traded or otherwise. I agree he appears to be a Dempster clone, another aging pitcher benefitting from an outlier career season. If Holland is traded, I would hope the FO could trade Elvis or prospects for a replacement, ideally a pitcher who is a significant upgrade as I wonder how long Harrison can maintain his past effectiveness. Absent a trade I would roll the dice with Perez, Ross or Ogando. Granted, the latter is not ideal, but Upton represents a chance to obtain at 3 years of a very cost effective offensive upgrade. I would rather have Upton less Holland, than Holland without Upton.

Read romros post.. I rest my case. An argument could easily be made that he/she contibutes less than anyne. I wonder if he is a troll for Eric or even worse maybe he IS Eric.

After awhile, we don't even really need our names, because we all develop our own style through language and structure. I can tell who most of you are before I see the name in red underneath your respective posts.

What the hell. I didn't post those last two things. What;s going on here???

Les,
Bleacher Report is a site with mainly crazy fans who base their opinions on little fact. All you need is 20/20 vision to know Holland can't even be in the same breath as an "ace". That's just crazy talk. Come on man!

For everyone saying Profar and Olt will be our backup IF, well the odds of that happening are slim to none. They are starters. Olt at the end of our bench does nothing but hurt his value. See the end of last year. If he's not traded, best case he builds his value/name back up and is traded at the trade deadline.

Fireball, CJ did, should have remembered, it is over the pitching history of the Rangers not a common occurrence. Hopefully, that will change. Good recall..

Towers: We'll give you Upton for Olt, Holland and (fill in the blank)
Daniels: silence
Towers: We'll give you Upton for Olt, Perez and (fill in the blank)
Daniels: done

Stefan you know that, I know that, but it seems for one 'crazy fan' outside of Ranger territory does not. This only drives up Holland's value outside of Texas, at least with other team's fans. Perception counts, and can be capitalized on. Both Olt and Profar ended last year as the infield bench. However this is 2013, and though I would like to see the Rangers go with the strongest 25 that includes the bench, and in my opinion I would take them over other options, have conceded that sending both to Round Rock to start 2013 is the Rangers present conditional plans and the most pragmatic. This may even give a chance as a super-U for a player I hoped would be given a MLB chance: Yangervis Solarte. I posted last year that they should have brought him up, another year, another chance. Feel he could be the next Scutaro, but initially just a backup at:2b,ss,3b,lf,rf.

Calling Dutch an Ace is a bit of a stretch, but not completely laughable. In 2011 he had 4 shutouts which was up there with Cliff Lee and he had that amazing WS game 4. He was a beast and pitched 8.1 innings, giving up 2 hits(both hits were from Berkman switch hitting).2012 was definitely two steps back, but could Derek possibly be the best pitcher on our staff next year? It's possible I think, just highly unlikely.

@les

CJ was so killer in 2011, he even had a sub 3 era which was probably the first for a Ranger since Kenny Rodgers. So crazy that he imploded once the playoffs started, he was so fun to watch that year. It's pretty unbelievable that we even made it to one strike away with our Ace completely sucking it up.

Disregard any post that has my name. I am in the basement playingrodeo.

playing rodeo

This is getting ridiculous. This thread needs to be locked. Neither of these above clowns are me.

Look "not that eric", you're not intelligent enough not to capitalize every syllable in anyone's names so the mods don't really need an IP trace to ban dat ass.

Also, you're absolute garbage.

Boy Txball is adding a lot to the forum today.. I still think he is Eric's alter ego. Speaking of garbage-take yours out . Is it just me or does it seem Txball uses the word ASS a lot?

Primi - spot on

Les - you're kinda stretching it with perception based on a single fan's opinion of Holland. I'm not going to presume I know how most GMs (particularly, Kevin Towers) would value Holland but I feel safe in assuming he isn't viewed as an "ace".

Eh? Damn it, someone dock me for feeding the troll. It's becoming readily apparent it's some foreveralone kid who has some strange social disorder.

How much longer is Txball gonna be trolling on here? It's becoming apparent some forever alone adult has some strange social disorder.

Can we please ban the idiot who goes by the handle not that Eric. Why has it taken this long?

I'm not here to say Holland is an ace, but I would like to remind everyone his 2012 stats were skewed somewhat by that stomach virus that ate 10 pounds of his insides.

The stuff is there. Most nights we're just waiting for the control.That's probably a similar truth with Perez, and looking at our SP depth chart, that's the reason I wouldn't be willing to deal either one of them unless we're getting pitching back.