What is your opinion of the A.J. Pierzynski signing?
MJH on accountability
Olt, Sardinas & Grimm for Upton....Who says no?
The whole issue is the diamondbacks wanted a SS and werent keen on Olt. Now, do they have a different outlook since they already made a trade for a SS? I dunno. But the thing with any Upton trade right now is...what exactly do the Dbacks want? Maybe center a trade around Perez and Sardinas (as insurance against the guy they got)? What about something involving a catching swap? Montero coming and soto or ajp+alfaro going (soto or ajp because alfaro isnt ready. May not work if they have stopgap catching. I dont know much about their depth). Would probably need to throw in some other prospects as well though.
Nateaggie accurately observed: "But the thing with any Upton trade right now is...what exactly do the Dbacks want?"
Towers is incredibly indecisive and when he does make trades they often make little sense. Gregorius, Pennington, and Ross all appear senseless. At the winter meetings he rejected Cabrera, a much better player than either Pennington or Gregorius. He doesn't like Olt, despite being weak at 3B, and may not be enticed by even Andrus, stating there is too little contract control. Upton would be a huge improvement for the Rangers but I think his SSs will have to wash out before he gets serious about moving him.
Olt/Sardinas/Grimm is a solid package. You could probably net a pretty nice return for that. You know who could really use that type of package? The Yankees. They need a 3rd baseman, a shortstop in 2-3 years, and pitching depth/help. Problem is, all their valued property is either too old or too expensive.
Sardinas is going to end up being better than Gregorius, but I don't think it would make sense from AZ's perspective to go after another SS prospect; they need a proven commodity like Elvis.
Still, interesting package.
The problem with trading for Upton is Towers is obviously an idiot.
More on AZ fan reaction to Towers' recent moves:
Eric, the Yankees are going to get their shortstop in 2-3 years, and his name is Andrus. Won't cost them anything in terms of players either, just a shit load of money. Which as we all know only too well, is not a real big deal to them.
David, I've been conducting the Elvis-will-be-on-the-Yankees-in-two-years train for months. I know. I was just trying to find a nice way to say "The Diamondbacks won't accept that trade" without starting a forum flame war, which is apparently something I'm halfway decent at.
However, contrary to this: "Which as we all know only too well, is not a real big deal to them," the Yankees actually do care about the money they're spending, which is why they haven't done anything this offseason. They want to abide by the $189 million luxury tax. Them boys in New York ... they look like they're adopting the Rangers' style of business. Big market, small market mentality. They are just waiting for the Granderson's and Jeter's and Rodriguez's to run out of contract. (They'll have to wait awhile on A-Rod.
If they sign Elvis, they'll have to do a lot of finagling to stay under the threshold. At least until a few more contracts are off the books.
I do not think Andrus is a sure lock for the Yankees unless they plan now, which apparently they are trying. But fundamental to every thing the Yankees are doing is to  have a competitive team now and above all  get the payroll below $189m. We will know if Andrus is headed to wearing pinstripes if the Yanks do not panic, as they have acted this off-season, and sign every big name in site because Toronto and Tampa beat them out in the East, thus removing any hope of getting below their wished for threshold, even after having some big contracts coming off the board. So if that is the case and the Diamondbacks see their only chance of beating out the Dodgers and Giants is to fill that big hole at a key position, thus trade for an all star SS with intangibles off the board. Elvis for Upton, with second tier prospects to balance out and make JD and Nolan pull the trigger. I personally think JD missed out earlier, not so much trading for Upton a month ago, but not getting Bauer at a time when the could have had both. The trade for Gregorius was not so much obtaining a ss prospect, but getting rid of a super talent only because he marches to his own drum, and lack of a better word, pissed off the Diamondbacks coaching staff. Sardinas could prove to be a better shortstop eventually then Andrus or Profar or Garcia, and should not be included in a trade. Olt is another one to hang on to, so the Upton deal has been obvious from the beginning, really defined when Josh signed with LA.
Saw a trade proposal similar recently in one of the espn chats for Upton, it was Garcia, Olt, and Buckel and they all thought that was a fair trade and that ARZ would probably do it.
I fear selling low with some of our middle infield prospects if we move them now. Here's why.
The glare from the Quasar known as Profar diminishes the perceived luminance (value) of Sardinas, Garcia and Odor. But whenever I've heard scouts talk about these players...they rave.
I've also heard it explicitly said: If Sardinas (or Odor) were in another system...they'd be getting a LOT more attention.
Just as other teams can undervalue these "secondary" prospects...I know we in the fanbase do as well. I trust that JD, Levine, etc won't fall into the same trap.
I wouldn't be surprised to see at least one of these three (Sardinas, Garcia and Odor) be in some top-50 national prospect lists within the year. It help all three of them...and their trade value...when Profar transitions from "prospect" to "player."
As per the trade...I absolutely would say no. Olt and Sardinas are absolutely going to play in the league for a long time. Grimm is 50-50 to be a #4 or #5 starter.
Upton? He's worn out a welcome a year after being an all-star. Booed at home? Sounds like Hamilton redux.
Yeah Eric, I've noticed that.Wouldn't it be nice if we all premature in our predictions, and Texas winds up ponying up the money to keep Elvis? I got to agree with ProfarMVP on his Sardinas analysis as well, I've had a gut feeling that he is gonna turn out to be a huge surprise ot alot of people, a perenial first division shortstop. It may take him a while to develop, but fortunately for Texas, they have a lot of time to give him. As for trading him for Upton, I definitely do that deal, it's a simple matter of making the team better now as opposed to 5 years down the road.
Arizona should do that trade, but I doubt Towers would. I agree on the opinion that one our middle IF will blossom this year. I think it was either Newberg or Parks that predicted Sardinas would be this years Mike Olt and soar up the prospect boards. Reading all the scouts rave about our up and coming 2nd tier prospect class gives me hope a few of them will make a huge jump by the trade deadline/next year giving us a ton of ammo for Stanton or whoever. Some of those guys are so young that if they click, they're ceiling would be superstar-esque. Might was well roll the dice now.
Garcia, Odor and Sardinas will/ are not surprises, they are all rated by Baseball America as first with score defining first division regulars. Garcia is held in such high esteem that the Rangers would not even consider Bourn and will move Garcia o ff short to center field with belief he could be another Bourn, but with higher batting upside. Sardinas has always been thought to be on par with Profar, just not the fame, but has due to injury have a hard time getting started. 2013 will prove big for Luis. Odor is a second baseman hitting machine, and the successor to Ian, with target 2015 or 2016. My guess is that the Rangers will try to sign Elvis to a long term deal, but being currently a Boras client: unlikely. And thus, if the Diamondbacks do not panic, can probably get Andrus for Upton sometime in March. In between, the Rangers will not panic, and hold on to their future by not trading high potential prospects, and the Rangers have more to fit that description then any other team. On the flip side, Loria panic is a given; so stay tuned to a Stanton move. So a trade with Grimm and Upton could evolve to Andrus and Grimm for Upton and Skaggs [ who almost got traded to Cleveland ].
I believe Daniels see's Olt as our 3B in near future, as with Profar. Upton is very sugar coated & streaky.Funny, but it wasn't too long ago, that Cruz had the similar upside talk as Stanton has now- BIG Future!
Obi, I'm curious what you mean by "Olt as our 3B in near future."
You see us moving Beltre? (His contract ties us to him through 2016--4 more years)
It would seem to me that if we seek to trade him it would need to be next offseason, before his value plummets. Wouldn't you agree that right now he's our best everyday player?
I'm not debating with you this...I'm trying to understand your point of view.
@ProfarMVP, I feel that if Moreland fails to seize the 1B spot in the next year and we have still retained Olt, then Beltre is a likely candidate to take over first base with Olt taking 3rd in the near future, especially if we begin to notice a defensive decline at 3rd as well.
There is a large gap between Beltre now and how far he has to decline to be worth moving off of 3rd.
Why would Arizona do this trade exactly?
Nompton, they would not. Arizona has to compete with LA and SF, and sees their greatest need as a top of the line SS. Gregorius is a prospect who hit .243 at AAA, not one to carry the Diamondbacks to the play-offs. That is why Sardinas, who may be outstanding but after at least 2015, is not what they are looking for, Andrus is another story.
@brian, I agree. Beltre might be 34, but he was the best defensive 3rd baseman in baseball last year. This is the exact same thing that happens with Andrus regarding Profar. People love prospects but forget just how unique the players we have are. Andrus and Beltre are both top 2-3 defensive players at their position and NO ONE in baseball moves either of those guys off their base.
Notify me of follow-up comments via email.