We'd all love to get Shields or Price, and maybe that will happen. But if it doesn't, it seems that the Rangers could realistically sign Hamilton, trade Andrus for Upton, and trade Olt for Dickey. The Rangers currently have a $105 mil payroll, and I have no reason to doubt ownership's statement that payroll is capped at $130-35 mil. So signing Hamilton would eat up most of the FA $. Trading for Upton and Dickey would add a few million to payroll, and the Rangers probably need a few mil to sign a catcher. So this scenario would likely involve dumping Cruz's salary ($10 mil). But it does sound doable.

I'm not crazy about Olt for Dickey. But as it stands now, we have no depth at starting pitching. And a lineup with Hamilton, Upton, and Beltre in the middle of the order would be pretty imposing.

Any thoughts?

Hoestly, I know JD has a plan but I think Greinke was a huge part of that plan. The curse of signing the #1 pitcher continues in Texas. So it looks like unless we draft a true ACE, then we will never have one. Yes Darvish is a #1 but is he really an ACE? Not in my opinion. But back to my point, I think this hurt the team more than we will ever know. I don't know if Hamilton comes back (I don't think he does), I don't know id we get Upton (I really don't see Profar taded fro Upton), I don't know if we get Shields (I doubt it very seriously), and I think Hellickson is no better than Harrison or Holland, so saying all of that, I think this is a rebuilding year. Yes we will be competitive, but World Series not as the team stands right now. Sometimes you need to step back once to step forward two steps. I do not agree with the trade of Loux to Chicago, I really think Loux was good enough to help the team this season in one shape for m or fashion. I do not agree with trading Olt for Dickey, the knuckleball will not play well in the AL (does anyoen remember Wakefield with Boston?). I say give Perez and Grimm a shot in the rotation. Sign Hamilton if possible and roll with it. That may be our only option at this point.

Man, Dickey is a tough pill for me to swallow. I honestly don't want any part of him but I'll trust JD on that one.

So many things wrong with your statement Chuck. First of all, after one season how can you determine whether or not Yu is an ace? Secondly, Grienke is NOT an ace. He's very good but in the same category as Kershaw, Sabathia, Weaver? I don't think so. I think there is some discussion as to whether he would be the number 1 starter here. The Dodgers just paid 150M for a number 2. If Hamilton is back this is still one of the best teams in the AL and a true contender. If others are added through FA or trade, even better. Ranger fans please don't go over the fiscal cliff just yet.

Hamilton will come back to Texas if Texas offers him the most $. Texas has the payroll room to do it if they are so inclined. You have to pay if you want to get impact players through FA.

I'm not very big on Dickey, especially considering what the Mets are asking for him and his age/contract/ contract demands for next year. I'd rather roll with what we have, which is Yu/Holland/Ogando/Harrison with Colbra hopefully rounding into form before the playoffs.

Age has nothing to do with RA Dickey's ability to throw the knuckleball. I hope we trade for him. He is the only person in the history of the game to throw a knuckleball in the 80s. That makes his knuckler break only a few inches rather than a foot or more.

The AL is as soft or as even, as it's been in years. IMPACT players, through trade or via FA, are going to cost.
Do the Rangers merely want to compete for the AK West or do they want to meet Detroit or Tampa, in the ALCS?

That being said, the winning BEAST of the NLCS, will have a strong Pitching Staff. Rangers must meet in like form.
Believe it or not, there's much to accomplish in a positive manner, during & after the All Star Break. Patience is a virtue,
but hopefully MUCH better than the 2012 FO short comings.

This post and other places center on Olt to NY for Dickey. I don't understand why NY would be interested. They just locked up Wright. C'mon man!

Olt for 1 year of Dickey is an overpay I'm not willing to do.

Leonys Martin Perez for Dickey

On second thought... MEHHHHHH

Maybe they're eyeing Olt for the 1B spot. Could be they're not entirely sold on Ike Davis and his .227 BA in '12 at 1B and would try to trade him if they can land Olt.

I'm EXTREMELY upset Greinke is not a Ranger and I agree that JD thought he had Greinke in the bag and may have under-estimated the greed that's now part of professional sports.
I do trust JD to find something but he's not going to find a pitcher like Greinke unless he's willing to part with half the farm system for David Price... and BTW, the Rays are a very well run team and it seems they always come out of trades as winners... they are very shrewed and are dealing from an area of strength. They will want the moon for Price... and probably Schields too. Maybe it's time to look at some of the fringe teams (i.e. the Phillies) and try to find a TORP (i.e. Cliff Lee) they may be willing to deal away when they realize they aren't contenders.

I say hell NO to Dickey. Nice guy... great story... but he will get crushed in the AL West. The only reason I'd want him is to eat up innings like Wakefield. You could count on Wakefield making 32 starts and didn't care if his price point was up in the 120's-130's... that's the only benefit to knuckleballers and I'm not convinced Dickey is the 2nd coming of Wakefield.

Shields is another Matt Harrison or Colby Lewis... and I'm not so sure he's any better than a healthy Ogando, is he? Besides, do we really need more #3s and 4s on this team? I realize Lewis is out until mid season but still, a rotation of of Darvish, Dickey or Shields, Harrison, Holland, and Ogando won't strike fear in anyone.

I think we are going to be very dissapointed going into 2013 with Darvish front-lining the rotation. I don't think he can handle the pressure, not yet anyway... and unless JD pulls off some completely unexpected trade for a true TORP (maybe King Felix?), we're looking at a very average to sub-par rotation, and that's assuming everyone exceeds their 2012 season, which we'd be stupid to expect from everyone. Throw in no Hamilton, no Upton, and no real upgrade at catcher and in the bullpen, and you're looking at an 82 win team at best.

I'm not on board with getting Dickey if we have to give up Olt. 6 years of a top-50-ish prospect for one season of R.A. Dickey isn't all that appealing to me, especially because we really don't know how to project Dickey. He's moving from a pitcher's park to an offensive one, and it includes the DH every time through the lineup.

Acquiring Dickey just seems like it would go against the organizational philosophy of power pitchers. They've quickly given up on virtually every gimmick hurler they've had over the last three years, whether it was O'Day, Eppley, Rapada.

Also, I think it's either Upton or Hamilton, not both. Getting Hamilton means we'll have Elvis on roster in 2013. Getting Upton means we'll probably be without Elvis and have more cap flexibility to go after a better pitcher, like Shields, for instance.

@pablo
Greinke is not on the same tier as price. Price is in the same class as Verlander, kershaw, king Felix, cole Hamels, and Roy halladay.

Greinke is on the same tier as shields, the current version of Lee, and weaver. I don't put weaver in the top tier because of his home/road splits.

147m over 6 years is ridiculous for greinke. Glad the rangers didn't buy at that price.

Last year David Price and Zack Greinke posted identical 5.1 fWAR totals.

@eric

But last year David price posted a bWAR of 6.4 as opposed to Grienke's bWAR of 3.3. Just saying.

I personally think Grienke was using us to see how high they could get the Dodgers to go. I think he wanted back to the NL.

Eric, if the only move the Rangers make is signing Hamilton, I'd prefer they don't sign him. The Rangers won 93 games last season and are down about 10-13 WAR due to FA losses, injuries, and aging. So the team as currently constructed is probably an 80-85 win team. You can expect about 4 to 5 WAR from Hamilton. That gets you to 85-90 wins. I think 90 wins is a real stretch, and even that's not enough. So what's the point of wasting $25 mil next season on Hamilton if you aren't going to field a team that you expect to make the playoffs?

I think the Rangers have to get a hitter and a pitcher. I'm not convinced that the Rangers can get Shields, and I think Price is a pipe dream. If the Rangers get Hamilton and Dickey, then why not also bring in Upton for Andrus. Upton for Andrus makes sense whether or not the Rangers sign Hamilton. They can always dump Cruz's salary to pay for Upton. At $10 mil in a contract year, Cruz is a good bet for someone. It's not even a risk. If the Rangers could get $6 mil in salary relief and 2 players for MY, then they can probably get someone to take over Cruz's contract and maybe kick in a few prospects. I'd rather have Profar/Upton than Andrus/Cruz and Profar in AAA.

The idea that JD was somehow bamboozled by Greinke is absurd. It was the Rangers choice that they stopped short of offering the $147 million it took to get him, not a trick, and they decided that as much as they wanted Greinke, they wanted him with a contract that they liked, and didn't see him as being worth a number approximating $147 million.

Does that mean JD has a surefire way to get another top pitcher, or all the positional talent? Not necessarily. If the price is higher everywhere than they will pay, they end up in spring training kinda where they started when the 2012 season ended. We can hope for a Shields, Dickey, and so on, or hope that we see Hamilton, Upton, and the like, but all we get is whatever we get.

You want Lee? You do realize his contract was HEAVILY back-end loaded. As I've said before, the Phillies have already gotten the two "cheap" years out of that contract - I seriously doubt if his value is going to equal (and, in the later years even come close) to the cost of his contract.

And, you sell Dickey short. Wakefield had some really good years in Beantown. Then, his skill eroded very quickly. Charlie Hough (just to go back a little) had great success in the American League (specifically? Texas). Phil Niekro did well for the Yanks. And, the knuckler is a "miss the sweet spot of the bat" kind of pitch which doesn't really care which league it's thrown in. You'll see the occasional moon shot, but more often than not, you'll see that classic swing-and-miss... other times you'll witness mindless dribblers and zombie popups that Ian Kinsler would be proud of.

And, he's still a baby among knuckleball practicioners... he could easily go into his forties.

But, I'm not sure Olt would be the "guy" that would land him... more likely a Grimm/Buckel combo or a Martin Perez straight up. I'd sure take him. I loved watching Charlie Hough pitch for us.

And, I've seen slobberers all over themselves about Greinke... I've also seen some cooler heads on this forum who have counseled that he's really not an ace and truly cannot be depended on when the lights get really bright. I tend to side with the latter side and am glad we didn't spend all that money for him.

If Yu isn't an ace, he's not many days from getting there. His stuff is ... well ... the stuff of legend. When a right-handed pitcher can throw a pitch that wraps around the waist of a right-handed hitter the way that... whatever it is... pitch... wrapped around hitters like it did... he has something special. When he can throw curves with the technical skill and sliders that look like a pork chop sliding off a plate, he is special. He may not, yet, be an ace... but, he has the stuff of an ace and all he has to do is harness it.

Matt Harrison is a solid #2. Even though he doesn't throw a knuckleball, his pitches also miss that sweet spot on the bat. Holland and Perez both have the stuff to be solid #2s and even aces - provided they can harness that "stuff" they are throwing and can be consistent. Alexi Ogando is on another planet all by himself. His zippy fastball does something... I don't know... something... that causes really good hitters to miss it. And, his slider can be devastating. All he needs is a good change and HE's a solid #2 candidate.

We have a pitching staff. We have a great defense. We have ENOUGH offense, if our defense can be consistent, we can win the World Series this year. Anything on top of all that just makes us better.

We just need a manager.

HubZ writes, "The AL is as soft or as even, as it's been in years."

If winning 57% of intra-league games versus the NL is soft...then I agree with you.

The AL West was BY FAR the best division in baseball after the all-star break, 42 cumulative games above .500.

Pablo writes, "I'm EXTREMELY upset Greinke is not a Ranger and I agree that JD thought he had Greinke in the bag and may have under-estimated the greed that's now part of professional sports."

What made you think that was ever going to happen? Greinke was never coming here, boys. And his comments about the Ranger team and FO...were nothing more than a snow job. Get it into your heads, bros. No top FA pitcher is going to sign with the Rangers until we get a house with a roof. If that was JD's core plan...he was a fool in planning on it.

And frankly I think it utterly crazy that you want to disparage Greinke for doing what is in his best interest professionally. Or...if you are attacking the Dodgers for offering so much money...shouldn't you be equally appalled that the Rangers were offering the second most money?

C'mon. It's better this way anyway. We'll have our powder dry.

@RFan

You've been extremely pro-Hamilton since the offseason began, and rightfully so. He's the best hitter on the market. And yes, you're right, right now the Rangers are an 80-82 win team, probably less. We need a 4-5 win hitter, whether that's Hamilton or Upton, and we need a 4-5 win pitcher, whether that's Shields or Dickey. I'm highly skeptical Dickey is that guy, but if it is, we need a guy like Ike Davis to add some wins to our 1B situation. I'm just not a big believer in Moreland and Olt as a tandem.

I'm very anti-Hamilton. I don't want him back. Even if we got him back, that's $20-$25 million for 4-5 wins. I'd rather have Upton netting us 4-5 wins at $9.75 million.

If I had my druthers, I'd trade for Upton, trade for Shields, and sign Nick Swisher. I think that would give us our best possible lineup, overall.

"You've been extremely pro-Hamilton since the offseason began"

It's not so much that I'm pro Hamilton. He comes with all sorts of risks, as we all know. It just seems to me that if we don't get Hamilton, 2013 is very likely a rebuilding year. I'd be fine with Upton, Dickey, and Ike Davis, but it just seems unlikely to me. Trades are hard to pull off if they don't follow the standard pattern of a rebuilding team trading a star player to a team on the cusp in exchange for prospects. If it's possible for the Rangers to get Upton and Shields, I think that's great. But again, it seems unlikely. If you give up Andrus to get Upton, then who do you give up to get Shields. He's a 4 fWAR pitcher, so you're going to have to give up Olt, Perez, and Holland. And maybe even that doesn't get it done.

Wow! Well, after the Royals trade last night, I am even more convinced we roll as we are right now. I am not sure paying Hamilton $25mil per year for the next 4 or 5 is goign to make us that much better. I am not saying we are an 82 win team as we stand now, I think we will surprise some folks and be closer to 90 may even make the playoffs. But I do not see a World Series in the team as is, or with Dickey. Just my opinion. The beatings may now commence on this post.