What is your opinion of the A.J. Pierzynski signing?
MJH on accountability
I saw a picture (and also saw it at the game) where Kinsler put his arm around Josh after his last AB and torrent of boos that came along with it.
That is so poignant to me. His teammates, coaches, front office people NEVER quit on him. Even in his darkest moments. Even when he was barely a Ranger (his first press conference where teammates showed up simply to show their support).
But when they needed him the most, and all he had to do to give them what they needed was show up and play baseball... He checked out. He quit on the very people who stood by his side and were shoulders to lean on.
The only person I have ever said "quit" on his team was Lamar Odom as a Maverick. Josh didn't give off that Lamar Odom vibe. I am very upset with how he played down the stretch, but I still don't think he quit. I think that's just who Josh Hamilton is. He is a very inconsistent player that gets too much into his own head, and it affects the way he approaches the game. All the narrative that follows him is just too much for me anymore. See ya, Mr Hamilton.
Hold on Josh did not quit! so lets all stop with that right now.Josh wasn't very good for long periods of this season but I don't think he quit! Josh has a lot of issues addiction, Home life, baseball and even God yes God is an issue for Josh. People all around him saying he is the greatest thing to ever play baseball and to top it all off I don't think he's very smart. I don't know if he fried his brain with the drugs or if he was born that way but.... I think that the contract the movie the tabacco and everything else just got to him and he couldn't handle it. But if you think he quit on this team I think your wrong!Also Josh wasn't the only one on this team playing like shit down the stretch. Beltre was the only one hitting the rest of them were aweful. they have played to much baseball in the last 3 yrs and it caught up with them simple as that. you want to blame someone? Blame JD then Wash JD for putting a team together that went to back to back WS and Wash for not keeping the guys fresh for the stretch run.
I'm sorry. He removed himself from an important game and road trip to be sent back to Texas for specialized tests. All while Adrian Beltre who was dealing with much more serious issues had his testing done in CA so that he could remain with the team.
In my opinion he quit on the team long before that. And even if he didn't 'quit' doesn't all they've done for him deserve his 100% (which wasn't there) when they NEEDED HIM.
Quit: Josh was still out there hacking away. Blindly. The only play I felt he quit on was the botched popup in Oakland and he was expecting backup from Murph - which he got.
Throw Away: Josh's statement, "The fans don't pay to see me take a walk", to me, is far more destructive. If he'd quit, he'd at least have been walked a few times and not given away outs willy-nilly. Josh threw away at-bats like my kids throw away bird food at the zoo.
Josh was not who the fans came to see - he was a significant part of what we came to see, but we came to see Our Team Win. His ability to hit 12 homers per at bat was just icing on the cake - not the cake. Once Josh is gone, we'll regale him with all the venom currently reserved for C.J. Wilson (hear that, Josh?). We don't love Josh. We don't love the fact Josh can put manned baseballs in orbit. We don't care if Josh has addictions.
We just want our team to win. And, Josh interfered with that many, many times this year. The venom we currently vent at C.J. will be sweet compared with what we'll hit Josh with once he's gone (unless he learns to be a team player and pass the at bat on to the next guy when they won't throw him strikes - i.e. gets his overblown sense of himself under C.O.N.T.R.O.L.)
Saw the quote from Kinsler about that moment, and he said "don't listen to them (the boos). They'll cheer for you when your hot and boo when you let them down." Hamilton replied "Never do listen." grinned, shook his head, and ran out there.
Hamilton SUCKED last month, but I don't care. I want the guy gone as much as the next fan, but I would NEVER boo him while he, or any other player for that matter, is wearing a ranger uniform. We're not the fucking red sox or Yankees. I was embarrassed that Ranger fans were booing one of our own. I'm happy to see him walk in the offseason, but really disappointed that's how his last game will be remembered.
Quit = Lee Mazilli
Awful lot of people are going to wonder where the power went when we're rested up for 2013. You don't just replace 40+ 120+ like it's nothing.
I was there and was almost more disappointed in the booing than the performance. I agree. We support our boys no matter what. Especially during a game.
I agree with not booing our own, but I am tired of the Josh drama. Yes it will be hard to replace the production but I am not convinced he can keep it up. Just woundn't bet 30 million a year on it anyway. Time for Kinsler to go too. He is declining. Elvis is getting better. No brainer for me which one Profar replaces. Young has to either be relegated to the bench or go as well. I am a huge fan, but its time. Cruz is a DH. He kills us in the outfield and arguably his misplay in the WS last year is what stands between us and our 1st world series. Not sure what will happen with the cactching situation but I am afraid some fool owner will over pay for Napoli. Would like to see him back, but only if his contract is reasonable. Hoping we can trade Kins for a productive out fielder. Won't be Josh, but hopefully won't have the drama either. Yu and Harrison give us a very nice front of the rotation. Lots of potential in Holland and Perez but time for Holland to find consistensy. Not worried about the bull pen, Wondering if a Moreland/Olt platoon gives us the power you need. Think you have to give that a shot. Is a Gentry/Martin patoon in center the way to go. I think you have to give that a shot as well. One last thing. I would love Wash if he was a 3rd base coach. Just consitently screws up in game moves. JD gave him three young players to try and keep his regulars fresh down the stretch. He stubornly refused to play them. Two years ago he insisted on playing Vlad in the OF in the world series. He left Cruz in with a two run lead in the 9th of game 6 last year. He's playing Young at second base in September to rest Kins when he has Profar at his disposal. And he consantly screws up pitching moves. Yes, its time for Ron to go as well. Interesting off-season on the way.
Looking forward to seeing what JD does in the off season. I think he will come through.
Once Josh is gone, we'll regale him with all the venom currently reserved for C.J. Wilson (hear that, Josh?). We don't love Josh. We don't love the fact Josh can put manned baseballs in orbit. We don't care if Josh has addictions.
We just want our team to win. And, Josh interfered with that many, many times this year. The venom we currently vent at C.J. will be sweet compared with what we'll hit Josh with once he's gone
WOWWWW. Ed Looney (this is either a joke or incredibly accurate), please use "I" when you say hateful tripe like this. I am a Rangers fan and you do not speak for me.
I guess some people think that once you get to the top (or as close as you can get), you become entitled to winning and then have a right to treat anyone on your team like %$#@ whenever you think it'll make you feel better. That would certainly explain why Yankees fans can be so awful.
If this is what the bulk of Rangers fanbase is going to turn into now that we have a taste of winning, I don't want to be a part of it.
I agree Michelle. I think (woefully) that CJ Wilson didn't get 10% of what's headed Josh's way. And it makes me sad out fan base has turned to that. I get a little booing (only once he's in a different uniform) but yelling profanities and hateful things? C'mon.
I will be cheering for Josh. He will be in another uniform, a good thing for the Rangers. When I look at Josh I see volatility, meaning his performance greatly varies from the mean. For every multiple HR game there are multiple 0-5, 3+ K games. This is hard on a fan, watching a gifted hitter thrash in the batters box swinging at balls a foot outside the strike zone. It all appears to average out in the stats, though I am not certain it is the most efficient way to contribute to wins.
Josh has his issues: addiction, home, adultery, and religion, but it is only the first that is relatively unique to baseball and to his credit, he has addressed his substance abuse with sincerity and discipline. We as fans may not appreciate his talent as much because of his issues but any other team would tolerate them in exchange for his talent. Josh is going because he he is one of the most productive hitters in baseball, a free agent, and likely to earn one if the most lucrative contracts in baseball history. To afford Josh would be to leave other team needs unmet.
Baseball is full of players who are not nice. Ty Cobb may have been the worst person in baseball but there have been plenty others. From what I can see Josh is not one of these guys.
I can see how his smirks in response to poor play bother fans--I personally hated him twirling his bat after a strikeout--but smirking and joking at misfortune is a normal human reaction.
I give Josh a pass for pulling himself for his eye problems. There have been suggestions here and on the radio (Galloway) that Josh just didn't want to play those days. I have no idea if his trouble was real or imagined--though practically there is not much difference between the two in terms of being able to play--but he has shown the grit to play hard and with pain, so I am inclined to dismiss rumors from a sports broadcaster who had to sell a few hours of ads every day.
I hope Josh doesn't get an offer the Rangers are not willing to match, a far fetched, magical thinking kind of hope, but if not I hope he gets on well with his next team. This has been a tough year to watch Josh play, but he is easily the best player I have ever seen. Better than Maris, Bonds, Griffey, anyone. He was never a favorite player, but he could do everything done in baseball extremely well. For me, baseball has three components. There is being a fan of the team, a fan if a player, and a Dan of the game. I root for the Rangers, am a fan of Andrus, Beltre, and Gentry, and a fan of well played baseball regardless of the league, team, or player.
For reasons impossible to quantify (probably because I am wrong) I believe the Rangers will be as good a team without Josh. But I will enjoy watching him play, at least on his good days outside if Arlington, and in Arlington I will not boo him. Josh has done too much for this team to deserve its fans' ire. If I ever run into Josh I will thank him for the memories.
All players fall into slumps. The onus is on the manager to make adjustments so that those slumps have less of an impact on the team. You can't blame Hamilton, Kinsler or Face for sucking as often as they did, you can only blame Wash for not giving them more time off, for not keeping Face off the field, for letting Hamilton play CF, for keeping Kinsler batting first all season long, etc... The list of mistakes is endless really.
Notify me of follow-up comments via email.