What is your opinion of the A.J. Pierzynski signing?
MJH on accountability
I'd have used the same word if I was talking about a white guy, so I'm not sorry for saying it. But if you guys need a witch-hunt, have at it. This is 2012, not 1965. I was born an entire generation after the Civil Rights Movement. I don't have a racist bone in my body, and I don't wish death on anyone. So get over it.
We give words the power they have. There is nothing inherently bad about the word lynch, or any other word for that matter. Study the etymology of the word and you will see it's origin is much earlier than the 20th century. If we want to move on as a society we have to be able to reclaim "emotionally charged" words.
"Ron Washington should be lynched."... "I don't have a racist bone in my body."
You don't have a single fact to support there being a country club atmoshphere in the clubhouse.
Yes, Young is having an awful year and a case can absolutely be made that he could be replaced with current talent on the roster that would outperform his contribution.
But . . . you have not provided one single documented fact that clearly indicates a power struggle between Wash and JD. Olt is being worked into the team. Olt got put into a high leverage situation by Wash and delivered. That's a fact too. Let it play out.
Inventing conflict and reporting it as fact is crap.
Find one single harsh quote from Daniels towards Wash. You can't. Find one quote from the locker room that suggests that the team perceives a country club is in place. You can't.
You are inventing facts.
Inventing facts is crap. It is drivel.
You can have a valid opinion that there are better options than Young in that DH role. That opinion is supported by facts. I wouldn't dispute them.
But, you go wildly beyond that opinion and opine that JD knows abotu some country club atmosphere and that atmosphere cost us a world series or two? Given how Young is such a focus of this country club conspiracy, how is it that the country club cost us last season and Young drove in 5 runs and scored 3 during that World Series. How exactly did the "country club" cost us last year's world series????
Crap . . . drivel.
Racist or not, being that careless with your words is a surefire way to lose credibility. Refusing to acknowledge that it was, at a minimum, a poor choice of words is even more damning.
Young batted .259 in last year's World Series and led the team in fielding errors (2) and lack of plays at first base, who knows. The country club assertion, opinion or whatever semantics you want to use is based on a manager that says that there is nothing that Young can do to get benched, his WAR stat is -1.4 and he leads the team in hitting into DPs at 15 and Washington looks the other way. If you think the country club theory is crap show me an example of any other manager in baseball that stuck with a player this long playing this bad.
As for replacing Young's productivity, please. Really? How about Gentry at CF and Murphy DHing. So, you think what I write and opine is crap and drivel then convince me how it's not a country club. Are you really defending M. Young and his play? Show me how he is not getting a pass and while you're at it, take a break from the low brow insults and explain JD's moves in response.
So, let's put it out to a vote on this forum: Everybody chime in. Is Young getting a pass from Washington? Yes or No?
Absolutely yes, and he admits doing so. According to Wash, MY will have to start hitting .215 before Wash even considers benching him.
PS: well said, My Real Name.
Honestly, I couldn't give a shit less what anyone has to say about my word choice. I know what the truth is to what I said, and I know I meant no harm by it, so if you'd like to take it somewhere that it doesn't need to be taken, go ahead.
Ok well it's also tiring to keep hearing the same ol same ol, we have x number of games lead in the division and then all these other stats. Ok, so what? Does that not mean we can't improve? The whole because we have a good record so who really cares what is going on day to day is a stupid and juvenile way of looking at things. You don't care if MY plays over Olt? Did you seriously say that? Why did we even bring this guy up if he's going to ride the bench everyday. He can be working on his swing in the minors instead of wasting away up here because we have an incompetent manager at the helm. MY is a cancer to this lineup. He is basically our DH and has the numbers of some minor league spare call up. Statistically, he is the worst everyday player in baseball. And you don't care that this joke of a player plays every single day in the middle part of the lineup?
Take the sunshine pumping and pom pom cheering somewhere else. This is the last place I expect to read that.
If the playoffs started tomorrow, do you really trust this team against the Yankees? With the way our pitching staff is and how our offense is so inconsistent, I do not.
Yes, Young is getting a pass from Wash, whether he likes it or not.
I'm going to say something about Eric...and then something to Eric.
I for one absolutely believe Eric...that he doesn't have a racist bone in his body. He's in his early twenties. I've heard people his age use the N word and other ultra-charged words that we of an older generation wouldn't imagine using. And they are in fact (generally) a very non-racist generation. That group growing up just doesn't see it the same way...they don't see those words as inherently hurtful. And the controversy of those Anti PC words sometimes makes them a juicy choice.
That said....Eric...You are making it harder for critics of RonRon to engage in a dispassionate discussion about his many shortcomings and the *possible* merit of replacing him. There is an age old Solomonic proverb that I try to remind myself about, "With sweetness of speech comes much persuasion."
I know you want to write and persuade. Maybe give it some thought?
I have been a big fan of Wash and defended him dozens of times. Until the past two months. But this season he has averaged 1 or 2 brain dead decisions every single game.
A very short list of some in the past 3 weeks:-He used Joe Nathan one night after Joe threw 37 pitches...and did so when the team was up by 5 runs!!! Nathan was out for 3-4 days after that and had to have an injection in his shoulder.
-He repeatedly has been an petulant bitch when reporters ask very good questions about his decision-making.
-He has thrown players under the bus for his mistakes
-His refused to use Gonzo for a month...and then when his name should have been reasonably called...he sends out Young instead. That's wasting an invaluable roster spot.
-His use of Olt, Gentry and Murphy relative to Young is simply beyond the realm of a thinking manager.
-His bunting strategy is utterly lacking in contextual sensibility
-His philosophy on closers is close-centric instead of win-centric.
If you track this site regularly you've seen this go on repeatedly this year.
That's fine. And this is what I have to say about Wash: I don't dislike the guy. I don't wish him to be fired. I never said those things. And although I don't find him to be a very forward-thinking man, I respect that the players seem to love him and rally behind him. After all, the only thing I really care about when it comes to the Rangers is that they're winning. I'm not going to argue with back-to-back AL pennants and being the odds on favorite to claim a third consecutively.
However, my words are being blown way out of proportion for what I actually meant. So I'm not going to apologize for what I said; I'll rescind the wording for how it was taken. If that's not good enough, then so be it.
I don't feel any need to defend myself beyond that.
Yes, Young is getting a pass. He's been getting a pass for several years. It is what it is and frankly, no I don't care if Wash decides to put him in everyday because he's earned that right and been given the opportunity to manage by the FO. Also by doing so he's going to seal his own fate in the end anyway.
Wash seems to place a great deal of value in his relationship with Young and you know what good for him. It takes a certain degree of character to stand up for someone who continually fails miserably. Seeing as how Young was one of the main individuals to stand up for Wash several years ago it makes sense that they have a bond that extends beyond reason and logic. Looking at a players stats and deciding he is worthless and should be benched when he consistently fails is easy. But standing up for someone you believe in at the risk of being identified as ignorant, out of touch or just plain stupid takes courage.
From where I sit perhaps the Rangers get beat in one of the playoff series and fail to win the WS for the third year in a row. And maybe Young's decline plays a significant role in that outcome. But, whatever happens about I think I can probably deal with it, seeing as I have been dealing with their inability to win a WS for my entire life.
I believe an organization can impose a set of values and expectations that breeds winning. There is a reason that certain teams continually fail and others succeed. Allowing someone to remain on the team for loyalty reasons will not work in the long term. Obviously there is a trade-off for the fans but I enjoy winning and seeing the best product on the field. The Rangers have several players up for new contracts. If you feel some sense of loyalty to these players, you will be stuck with an aging Cruz, Hamilton and Napoli that will most likely have similar performance drops in 3 to 5 years. The Yankees paid Jeter, Rodriguez and Texiera and now they are trying to win in spite of these contracts. I still remember when Tex went down in the ALC series after hitting for around .100. Last night, I was laughing at Jeter trying to make plays at short (current dWAR is -1.4). Rodriguez is most likely dating a wrestling diva in Mexico. I prefer watching players in their 20s and early 30s while at their peak or who are growing. I do not like watching teams like Philly who fail to reload. The Rangers do not have a similar payroll structure to absorb bad contracts and baseball is not a fountain for eternal youth.
I mostly agree with that Guest. Although I think in this particular case there is a difference between the loyalty Wash feels towards Young and the loyalty JD and the front office has towards Young. Generally, I would imagine that JD's loyalty is to the organization as a whole rather than to individual players. Thus, I don't believe we will see Hamilton, Cruz or Napoli recieve significant extensions. They might be resigned if they are willing to turn down other teams best offers but I can't see JD activily attempting to outbid other organizations for their services. I actually think the Young contract is exactly why JD hasn't made a point of extending players to far into their declining years.
Wash on the other hand is loyal to certain players like MY to a fault. If Wash is still managing the team when the Beltre and Kinsler contracts begin to expire I imagine we will be having some of the same discussions we are having about Young right now and had about Guerrero a few years ago. It just seems to be who Wash is. I think if the Young situation has taught JD anything its that you can't give a manager who values loyalty the chance to put players who are past their prime on the field. And the only way you ensure that those players don't reach the field is to either get rid of the manager or just don't sign/extend players who are approaching the point in there career where decline is imminent.
MFix, answer the question. You hyperbolized that Wash's country club cost us a world series. Explain how Young cost us the world series last year.
I DON'T have a problem with folks that argue Young is a train wreck this year. I do have an issue with taking this year's problem and fabricating facts about last season for dramatic effect. It's crap.
Reasons why the Rangers lost the WS. The number 1 reason would have to be the AL lost the all-star game. The Rangers were forced to play 4 games using NL rules that improved the Cardinals while at the same time weakened the Rangers. A small part of that resulted in MY playing first base way too often. These games were also played on the road in front of a very lively crowd. If you disagree, look up the stat for home field in the World Series. In my mind, the Rangers were the best team and the playoffs are a crapshoot of luck and circumstance beyond the team's control. Country Club appears to be used instead of good ole boy network. Wash employed a good ole boy network atmosphere which helped contribute to the losses. Please do not take offense to my usage of good ole boy network. I would use collective narcissism but I feel that would lose some meaning here.
Guy- first I didn't write M Young cost the Rangers the WS I said he wasn't an asset but a liability. His two errors in game 6 cost the Rangers two runs. In 2011 postseason he batted .259. In 2010 Post season he batted .229. You state he was a contributor I disagree.
"country club"- means giving some players a pass while others are on a short leash. Most people on here agree that Young has gotten a pass. So, if one player can perform poorly while players that have performed better then that says that the manager doesn't base his lineup on meritocracy but favoritism. That's not hyperbole but basic deduction that any person would learn in logic 101.
Would somebody more eloquent than me please better explain this?
Can we at least agree that as long as MY is penciled into the six-hole that we rename it the "sink-hole?"
Why on earth would you need someone else to explain your own words???
Here they are . . .
"JD knows that the Country Club mentality has caused the Rangers to pull up short twice."
It was my impression that JD kept Young on the team in 2011, rather than trading him, because he expected him to play the role of PT DH, PT 1B and b/u at other positions that would provide more value to the team than he could find on the trade market. That role that JD envisioned as he constructed the 2011 roster is how Ron used him last year.
Young then went out and put up a .338 BA with an .854 OPS (3rd highest of his career) last year. He also went out and played the kind of substandard defense that JD was very well aware of when he decided to have him play that role on the 2011 roster.
Given the fact that JD kept Young on the team for the role Ron put him into last year and the fact that Young hit like the best of his younger self last year, how exactly did the "country club" cause us to lose the World Series?
They're your words. You don't need someone else to explain them. Step up.
JD did try to trade Young but couldn't. He got close with the Rockies but Young had a no trade clause to them.
The point I am trying to make, and since I haven't got through to you I'm hoping somebody else will/can, is that if player A can perform poorly and there are no consequences where player B has one bad game then rides the pine for two weeks, then that is favoritism. Get it?
P.S The Ben and Skin 1033 espn show spent over 30 minutes talking about how the Rangers needed to bench Michael Young.
And what on earth does Ben and Skin spending 30 minutes discussing the need to bench Young THIS YEAR have to do with your assertion that JD knows that a country club atmosphere LAST YEAR or THE YEAR BEFORE.
Please see previous question.
"Given the fact that JD kept Young on the team for the role Ron put him into last year and the fact that Young hit like the best of his younger self last year, how exactly did the "country club" cause us to lose the World Series?"
I'm assuming you can't answer it because you now realize you were just blowing gas and being hyperbolic and making THIS year's problem into a cause of last the last two years's "failures" to win a world series.
My point on any number of threads like this is it would be nice if we could have an honest discussion and leave the hyperbolic and inaccurate ranting out of it.
Okay, I'll try one last time and then if not let's agree to disagree.
JD has tried to move Young out of the lineup for the past two years. First, he signed Beltre because Young's defense at 3rd was horrible. With the lose of Cliff Lee they needed to upgrade at 3rd to keep the earned runs downs. Young took umbrage. JD tried and tried again to trade Young but the only taker was the Rockies but Young had a no trade clause with them and the deal feel through. Then JD made a move for Napoli to be the DH as the scouting reports on him was that he was too chunky to be a day in day out catcher, but could be a solid hitter at times. With the signing of Torrelba Young knew that Napoli was brought in to be a DH. He took even more umbrage to that and demanded to be traded. At that point, with his salary, there were no takers.
Postseason 2010-Young batted .229 and was horrible which is what led to the above transactions. In 2011 postseason he batted .259 and was not good in the WS. He had a great regular season in 2011, everybody agrees to that, but in 2012 even the scouts have noted that his bat swing has slowed significantly. (Reference Ben and Skin yesterday.) He is not in a slump but is aging. This year he is the lowest rated player in baseball of full time players.
If you want to make the Randy Galloway argument that Michael Young is an "Icon" and "Icons" can not be benched due to the damage it would cause the dugout or that he can't be benched because he is the leader of the team and to debase the leader of the team would kill the morale of the players then okay, then I'll accept that as a counter argument. But one thing is clear is that Ron Washington, no how good/bad Young plays, will not bench him or reduce his playing time. Ergo, a pass.
So, I hope you're right and that is just a long slump for Young and his best is yet to come because for the Rangers to win Young will have to perform. Whether you like my writing or opinions or not at least I hope we agree upon one thing, that we want the Rangers to win.
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