@ WWJDD I never jumped into the Butler thread because I thought it would be rediculous to trade for a guy that is at best a DH for most AL teams. IMO Moreland will surpas Butler's value in a couple of years. Plus after signing Beltre we now have a grossly overpriced DH in camp already. There are 3 major differences in these scenarios. 1) Kansas City KNOWS that they will not be competitive for atleast 3 years, Florida thinks they have a chance at the wild card. 2) Florida would probably still compete for the Wild Card in any of the scenarios that I laid out above. 3) Billy Butler wouldn't help us at all but JJ and HanRam would make a huge impact

Ok lets say that Detroit has fallen way out of contention around the all star week would the Rangers have a shot at Justin Verlander or is he un touchable?

Why would Florida trade both Hanley & Johnson - for ANYONE - before the season has started?

Why would St. Louis trade both Pujols & Wainwright - for ANYONE - before the season has started?

Okay, I backed away before but now I'm just going to say it - yes, it's fun to talk "what if?" - but really a lot of you guys are really talking about fantasy baseball, not real baseball. You aren't taking into consideration salary, free agency, and most importantly, a team's need to have a product to sell in these dire financial times (i.e.: you can't totally piss off the paying customers).

@ WWJDD Do I think it is likely to happen before the start of the season, no. Is it a possibility, yes. Do you not think that Hamilton would put as many butts in seats as JJ or Felix it would be mor lucrative for those clubs to trade for a Kinsler or Hamilton as they are everyday players not just every fifth day.

@ Martin No I think he is untouchable. Detroit isn't a team in rebuilding mode they aren't going to hit the panic button. They will contend in 2011.

thank you WWJDD for being a voice of reason... this thread has reached ridiculous hypothetical measures in a matter of hours. It went from an already ridiculous discussion of trying to steal Johnson from Florida to talking about trades that include Pujols?

@ WWJDD Do you think Brewers, Phillies, Braves fans all had similar discussions ie "not real baseball" I don't know what is going to happen. I do know that your argument is the safe bet, I commend you for it, but your point has been made move on.

I suspect that a blockbuster deal involving Hanley Ramirez is, indeed, possible, if highly highly unlikely. But Albert Pujols is an entirely different matter. And Josh Johnson is about as untouchable at this point as anyone in baseball. When he nears free agency, and is about to get "real paid," as Beck would say, then yeah - trading him for a bunch of primo prospects is good business sense. But come on - it's January. At this moment, teams are trying to get their squads ready for ST. Why on earth would Florida, who by all accounts believes it can compete this season - based on the strength of its pitching - why why why would they then trade away that very strength now?

The answer is simple - they won't.

Regarding the "Brewers, Phillies and Braves" - those are apples to oranges, my friend.

Some people like to talk trades in reality... some people like to talk trades in fantasy. The problem occurs when both types of people are trying to talk trades on the same thread.

Please take in account: skill level, contracts, salaries, owed money, team control, arbitration, club loyalty, fan-fare, marketing, positions, injury history, etc when discussing these types of Pujols and Wainright for Hamilton and CJ trades.

WWJDD was not being unreasonable with his assessment of these trade proposals. They seem rather fantasy. I believe he, much like myself, prefers to talk trade reality.

@gtownfan - I never said it wouldn't make sense to trade Hamilton for the right return, I just said I never would. And I noted my bias. I am not a GM so I can have my opinion of which players I would never trade. It's not an argument, it's an opinion...both of us are right and both of us are wrong.

Screw trading for Josh Johnson, I truly believe that if the right package is there for the Mariners side, they will trade Felix Hernandez. With that said, don't look for the Rangers to trade for any starters until the trade deadline. They want to take a long hard look at what the White Sox pitchers do, and want to see if the Rays would be interested in moving another piece. Don't be surprised if Carlos Zambrano's name gets brought up with the recent Matt Garza trade. A deal with the Cubs would almost certainly include Chris Davis. However, Zambrano is still due a big pay day for his final year.

I think a real possibility may be if the Cubs have one starting arm too many now. If the addition of Garza means that Zambrano or Dempster are available they would be interesting to look at.

What would it take to get Mark Buehrle or John Danks from the Sox?

Skeletor, if the White Sox fall behind in the AL central they might move a pitcher but as of now I believe only Gavin Floyd is available. I wish we would have never traded Danks. Sure would be nice to have that stud lefty over a guy who fractures a shoulder every time he breathes too heavily. I say that fully expecting Brandon McCarthy to be the veteran ace on the Oakland staff. With my luck he will throw 8 innings against us to clinch the division with our old buddy Dick Harden coming in to close.