What is your opinion of the A.J. Pierzynski signing?
MJH on accountability
Which of the following options would you all prefer now that we've dodged the Lee bullett:
A) Trade for Greinke (Giving up at least Perez, (Holland or Hunter), Beltre, Profar).
B) Trade for Garza (giving up less than for Greinke).
C) Trade for Garza and make a strong offer for Beltre (4 years, $60 million?)
D) Go with what you have and try and sign as many of Hamilton, Cruz, Andrus, and Kinsler as you can to long term deals with the Lee money you didn't spend.
E) None of the Above
Interested to see what everyone else is thinking. I'm leaning towards option C. I know a lot of people hate Beltre and think he's a contract year guy, but I think his defense is so good, especially relative to Young that he would really help. I also think he would hit well in Arlington, like he did in his other hitter friendly park in Boston. Seattle is a tough place to hit. The Latin influence of this team would probably be comfortable to him as well. He could bomb, but I don't think that's likely. With that said, 4 years and $60 million is the most I'd offer (even that is stretching it a little). If someone else takes him then that's fine, we just move to my 2nd favorite, plan B and then try and sign some of our core guys to long term deals. Say what you want about Garza, but he'd help us out a lot. He's just 27 and pitched very well in the AL East. He'd be even better against the AL West. The price for Greinke is too high in my opinion, and all of his little idiosyncracies about I will play here, but not there, etc., etc. are really starting to annoy me.
Trade for Greinke! Before Cliff Lee signed with the Phillies I was very heavily against trading for Greinke if we didn't get Lee but now for some reason I believe he is the answer..... The Rangers need to go out and get "THAT ACE" Jon Daniels will not sit long I guarantee you that.
Also your option D is a good idea as well. Sign Hamilton, Cruz, and KInsler with the leftover money.
F) Trade for Josh Johnson and sign Beltre.
In all the “Plan B” trade buzz surrounding the Rangers, I find it bewildering that Josh Johnson’s name has gone virtually unmentioned. Johnson would be at the top of my list of trade targets, above Garza and with Greinke being third. Johnson reminds me all the world of Matt Cain and just strikes me as having the kind of bulldog make-up that seems to translate so well into post season success, need we be reminded. He is signed for multiple years very reasonably and could probably be had from the always impoverished Marlins for a sub-Greinke price. Even if the Fish are not looking to move Johnson right now I’m sure with the right package they could be persuaded to listen, now or at the trade deadline next season.
Everyone is fussing about Greinke’s loose screws, but we need to remember that Garza is also a chronic head case and may be a bad addition to the ostensibly precious locker room chemistry this team has. Johnson has no such issues, and is far enough removed from TJ surgery to have proven his on-the-field legitimacy. The combo of Johnson’s World-Series-caliber stuff and make-up is what puts him at the top of my “Plan B” list.
But heck, if we want to go all in I say empty the farm, go get Johnson AND Garza, then sign Beltre and use Young as a super util/DH or trade young and bring back Vlad to DH. I want Beltre. His defense is amazing and that is a huge need for this team at the hot corner. We cannot endure another full season of Young at 3B. If we don’t get Beltre, the Angels will and that is not good for the Rangers. Keeping Beltre out of Anaheim would make for a wonderfully disastrous off-season for the Halo’s with the Crawford debacle and all, which is just what we need to keep our momentum going.
Why the fascination with Beltre? I don't want him for 10 million, let alone 15+ for 4+ years.
Guy has had two great years...2004 and 2010 (both contract walk years) and the rest of his career sums up to average starter level (~2 WAR ~100 OPS+) Let the Angels have him.
Rangers already have one overpaid league average 3B in his early 30s locked up to a long term high dollar contract...why do we need two?
I would take Beltre at 4/60 without blinking. You mention his career inconsistency, but I say that the real Adrian Beltre is the one we saw last year in Boston. All those years on Seattle he was the best bat in a really bad lineup, hitting in a really bad hitter’s park. Last year in Boston he was not the centerpiece of the lineup and he hit in a great hitter’s park. Those same conditions in Boston exist here in Texas. With the Rangers he would not be expected to carry the offense and he could hit in a park similarly friendly to Fenway, and I think he would flourish. And that defense…wow. If the Angels got him he would be a significant upgrade and probably make them the favorites in the AL West again.
Beltre is by no means an over-30 league average 3B. You say the Rangers already have one of those but I say they don’t even have that. Young is not fit to play 3B defensively so in my mind the Rangers don’t even have a 3B at all, much less a league average one in his 30’s. Beltre would be awesome here as a massive upgrade defensively at 3B and at least equal to if not exceeding Young’s offensive production.
Plan B:trade MY and Julio Borbon to NYM for Carlos Beltran and sign Adrian Beltre trade for Fausto Carmona and sign Brandon Webb
I would try to wow the Marlins with an offer that is similar if not better than Mark Texiera trade that sent him to Atlanta. (Beltre, Profar, Perez, and maybe Scheppers or Kirkman(lot of teams love him) Apparently, KC is asking for the moon for Grienke.
Why not try and trade for Yovani Gallardo from the brewers? they need more pitching Rangers need higher quality pitching
Yovani Gallardo for Tommy HunterDerek Holland and Tanner Scheppers??
Florida thinks they're getting better and I don't see them wanting or having a need to trade J. Johnson... last year when we asked about him during the Cantu deal, we were given a firm "no" -- why would their position have changed?
@MG93: why the hell would the Mets want Michael Young?
Of the above options, I like the idea of going after Garza, true -- he's not Greinke -- but you're not having to give up quite as much, I think he's signed for 3 more years and the Rays are less likely to be as picky as KC when it comes to the type of prospects they'd require. I'd make a strong move for Garza and look at signing another project guy like Webb, Wang or Young.
I don't hate the Beltre idea, but the money concerns me a little and I really don't see M. Young being too thrilled about being moved again and this time to DH.
to play second base and get rid of Beltrans contract
Seattle thought the 2004 Beltre was the "real" Beltre, too. Then after he signed his huge contract, he gave them league average production...pitchers park or not, 5 years of 266/317/442 is league average...by no means elite or even All Star level.
And OPS+ takes into account his home ballparks anyway and as I stated before...take away his contract walk years, and he is ~2 WAR and ~100 OPS.
But if you want to look at two years and ignore ten others, have at it
I don't think we can sign Beltre. Won't our antler hand sign violate his no head touching policy?
Marlins said no to Perez, Scheppers, and Beltre for Johnson, so if they want more than that, I'm out.
Greinke for Holland, Hunter, Profar, Skole, and a lesser pitcher.
Then sign Brandon Webb.
Then get a nice, cheap extra bat (not Vlad- dude is done).
Then convert Feliz to starter.
Then sign Nellie to an extension, maybe Kins too.
I would give up Holland for Greinke... but not for Garza. Something about Price and Holland in the future scares me... I'm not really sure why but I'm a Holland fan and I still believe he's going to be a very solid SP in this league. Maybe it's his personality but I really root for that guy.
But unless KC changes their mind on the type of guys that they want for Greinke, I don't see the Rangers as a match. Not sure what the package for Garza would be, and I don't know what type of prospects the Rays have in their system, but I would think something along the lines of Hunter, a SP prospect (not Perez or Holland -- maybe Scheppers) and someone like Chris Davis could maybe get that done? Who is playing firstbase with Pena gone now?
I would be on board with a trade for Garza (like I mentioned above, nothing too extravagant though), signinga guy like Webb or maybe even Wang or C.Young and then trying to get D.Lee.
I haven't heard Derrek's name in association with the Rangers and I wonder why that is... I've talked about him before on here, but I think those three moves with the addition of Yorvit would make for a successful offseason in light of losing out on C.Lee.
I would still be ok with pursuing Beltre too, as long as the money isn't more than $10M a year... but I'm sure someone else is willing to pay him more than that. Maybe a 2 yr $30M deal with an option? I could stomach that -- but not 4 years.
"unless KC changes their mind on the type of guys that they want for Greinke"
Their demands are a bluff. Holland, Profar, Hunter, Skole, and a lesser pitching prospect will get it done. Do it.
geeez-- a bunch of no-nothing amateur GMs. YAWWWWN
@Scooby: I don't mean the quality of the prospects... I think you're offer is sufficient, but if they want middle INF/OF help that can play now and someone else offers them that, they're not going to take our guys that are 2-4 years away from making an impact. I think we can offer them plenty of top prospects, but if they've got needs besides what we're offering them, and someone else can meet those needs, why trade with us?
Word is they're in love with Profar. He's MIF help later, not now, but they love him. Or we keep Profar and send them Beltre, who is nearly ready. Or we keep Skole, and send them Borbon. I'd do that too. And Holland/Hunter are plenty ready. I think this package matches up very well.
I would trade for Johnson in a heartbeat, if I thought the Marlins had any intention whatsoever of fielding offers on him. The thing is they are not fielding offers for him.
I'm really afraid that we go into desperation mode and make another poor trade like we have in the past.
I was talking about getting D.Lee last night when I found out about C. Lee. I think adding his bat and defense will help a lot.
I doubt we end up with Beltre, but that would make our Infield the best defensive infield in the league.
I don't think we should trade for Garza or Greinke. They are both young guys, but I don't see them getting much better. Holland could be another D. Price., Perez could be another J. Santana., Scheppers is a J. Zumaya type., Beltre = C. beltran, and Profar has been compared to H. Ramirez. Why would we give up that kind of talent for either one of those guys? I would be okay with trading Kirkman and Hunter for a veteran though.
I say that we keep developing our farm system and resign our proven players. We might not make it back to the WS next season, but in 2 more years we will have a DYNASTY!
Notify me of follow-up comments via email.